[Magdalen] Church as Personality Billy Graham

[FCBasle at aol.com]

Jay
 
So sad when this happens - but this is the danger when you try to live up  
to an expectation that you don't possess.
 
Sadly a similar thing happened with the Full Gospel Businessmen's  
Fellowship International in the USA (when Demos Shakharian's son Richard took  over) 
around the time when I was an FGP Chapter President in Driffield  (England)
 
Some how dynasties don't work well - even in the OT we find good kings  of 
Judah having bad sons.
 
I think we have to realise that God gives each one of us an individual  
calling - that isn't passed necessarily on to the biological son. Put another  
way God doesn't have grandchildren only children.
 
Blessings
Martin
 
 
In a message dated 04/04/2015 22:54:57 GMT Daylight Time,  
jay.weigel at gmail.com writes:

Billy  Graham I don't have a problem with, other than his association with
Richard  Nixon......although I think he honestly believed he could save the
man from  himself. Now his son Franklin, on the other hand, I think may be
possessed.  Or maybe just plain evil. He is a nasty piece of work, to be
sure.
A  really good example of the Church as Personality, IMO, is Joel  Osteen.
Yecccchhhh.

I have had my own experience, somewhat  tangential to be sure, watching the
rise and fall of a would-be dynastic  megachurch. (Those of you who have
heard this before may skip this part,  it's for Martin's benefit). A number
of years ago when I was estranged from  the church I began attending a small
full-gospel church in my neighborhood,  having been invited by a neighbor
woman of about my age. It was a very  welcoming church with an interesting
blend of older folks and enthusiastic  young newcomers, some with ties to
the state university. The pastor was a  fairly young man who was a very
gifted preacher and an excellent Biblical  scholar as well, with a vision
for that church to grow into something more  than just a small neighborhood
congregation.  And grow it did; by the  time I left that city they had
already outgrown their second building. I'd  returned to the Episcopal
church by then but kept some ties in that church  because I'd made many
friends there; it's just that I'd found that I was,  after all, happier in
the church I'd grown up in. Even after I moved away,  I kept up with it via
my friends who were there as it became a congregation  of several thousand
with a huge building and the school that Pastor H. had  dreamed of and
numerous "ministries" to all sorts and conditions of people,  from young
mothers to  seniors to bikers. His three children grew up  and went to
college and seminary and married well and then....just as it  all looked SO
perfect, the son-in-law who was being groomed to succeed him  was found to
be having an affair with a woman he had been counseling and  had to b e
shipped off to someplace in Oklahoma to "receive counseling".  There was
some doubt about whether the pastor's daughter would stick by him  (divorce
being frowned on, especially for clergy) but apparently she did,  though I
gather she's never been the same. Then there were financial  irregularities
with the school and a semi-scandal involving the eligibility  of a
basketball player there. People began to drift away, by ones and twos  and
then in droves. Soon they could no longer support their operation.  The
school closed, except for the preschool which had always been  profitable,
and some of the property was sold. The congregation had gotten  so small
that a couple of years ago it finally merged with another  congregation
which had never had its own church building. It's now led by  one of the
former assistants who used to be the minister to the bikers. It  looks like
it might be on its way back at last, but in a more subdued  fashion. Pastor
H. has retired, but is still available for assistance when  called on, I
gather. I can't help wondering if he wonders how he screwed  up.
(Addendum--I've learned that the school has reopened, but it's now run  by
another church of the same general  persuasion and outlook based on  the
other side of town.)

On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 2:47 PM, ME Michaud  <michaudme at gmail.com> wrote:

> I believe Jay is talking about  the children of these evangelicals.
> Both the young Schuller and the  young Graham have come to grief
> (although in different ways) in  "inheriting" their fathers' churches
> and legacies. As David said, "O  Absalom."
>
> Not a problem among Catholics, usually. Except for  folks like
> the Borgias and the Medici.
>  -M
>