[Magdalen] Bishop Cook: Another unfortunate piece of the story

Wed Feb 4 22:35:30 UTC 2015

I think the Episcopal church in Cambridge on Mass Ave did  at one time...

Lynn

My email has changed to: houstonKLR at gmail.com

website: www.ichthysdesigns.com

When I stand before God at the end of my life I would hope that I have not a 
single bit of talent left and could say, "I used everything You gave me." 
attributed to Erma Bombeck

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From: "Charles Wohlers" <charles.wohlers at verizon.net>
Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2015 4:25 PM
To: <magdalen at herberthouse.org>
Subject: Re: [Magdalen] Bishop Cook: Another unfortunate piece of the story

> That's not my experience at all. In 30 years in my parish in Mass., I 
> can't recall alcohol at any church events. Never been under discussion, 
> IIRC. It just isn't done. Likewise the parish up in Vermont.
>
> Maybe it's more a Southern thing? Or an upscale-parish thing?
>
> Chad Wohders
> East Bridgewater, MA USA
> chadwohl at satucket.com
>
>
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Grace Cangialosi
> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2015 9:22 AM
> To: magdalen at herberthouse.org
> Subject: Re: [Magdalen] Bishop Cook: Another unfortunate piece of the 
> story
>
> Two things, Sally:
>
> I'm afraid I know of several cases in which bishops gave good 
> recommendations for priests with obvious and serious problems as they 
> handed them off to other dioceses. Obviously, that's speculation in this 
> case, but there is precedent.
>
> As to the question about a culture of alcohol in the Episcopal Church, 
> you'd be hard put--at least in this diocese, to find a church-sponsored 
> event (except, usually, the Sunday morning coffee hour) where alcohol 
> wasn't served. The church where I served as music director several years 
> ago, had had an open bar during coffee hour, and the rector provided 
> Bloody Marys to the choir between services on Easter Sunday and mulled 
> wine between services on Christmas Eve.
> I've been at vestry and regional council meetings where alcohol was served 
> and/or where members came to the meeting smelling of alcohol.
> When I was training a parish discernment meeting, wine was served with the 
> dinner before the training, and I had to ask that that not happen the next 
> time the group met.
> When I was still in seminary, they instituted a policy that whenever 
> alcohol was served, there needed to be "equally attractive beverages" 
> available. Now VTS has an actual Pub in what used to be the small dining 
> room set aside for meetings over meals.
> I could go on and on, but I won't.
>
>> On Feb 4, 2015, at 2:57 AM, Sally Davies <sally.davies at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> If you drive under the influence, you don't get to blame others for
>> accidents. It alters the probabilities completely.
>>
>> I'm puzzled by the "we as a church have a problem with drink" idea. Is 
>> that
>> only in the USA, or elsewhere in the Communion? I'm sure not here.
>> Anglicans are less likely to be abstinent than other protestant church
>> members but as a group not more likely to abuse, I'm sure of that.
>>
>> Perhaps because of the strong evangelical influence in this part of the
>> world? And also that ideas of social responsibility attach to alcohol 
>> abuse
>> in particular. The entire society has severe problems with alcohol
>> abuse/dependency, so if Christians are involved with social ministry in a
>> spirit of love and empowerment (as most churches are), you have to be
>> sensitive to that.
>>
>> What I'm not hearing in all this, is more about the qualities that Bp 
>> Cook
>> possessed which influenced others to overlook such an obvious disaster
>> waiting to happen, despite presumably having at least SOME objectivity.
>> Other than the speculation about wanting to make her someone else's 
>> problem
>> which sounds exceptionally bleak.
>>
>> Sally D
>>
>>> On Wednesday, 4 February 2015, Jim Handsfield <jhandsfield at att.net> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> In addition, she apparently was texting at the time.
>>>
>>> Jim Handsfield
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>>>> On Feb 3, 2015, at 10:31 PM, Jay Weigel <jay.weigel at gmail.com
>>>> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Furthermore, she left the scene for some period of time, variously
>>>> described as from twenty to forty-five minutes. That's inexcusable.
>>>>
>>>>> On Tuesday, February 3, 2015, Grace Cangialosi <gracecan at gmail.com
>>> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> According to the police report--which, I believe was based on 
>>>>> eyewitness
>>>>> accounts--she swerved into the bike lane and hit him from behind. I
>>> haven't
>>>>> seen anything to refute that claim. And if she was texting, that would
>>> be a
>>>>> very likely consequence.
>>>>>
>>>>> On February 3, 2015, at 10:16 PM, "Mahoney, W. Michael" <
>>>>> wmmah at stoneledge.net <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Feb 3, 2015 at 6:10 PM, Ginga Wilder <gingawilder at gmail.com
>>> <javascript:;>
>>>>> <javascript:;>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I
>>>>>> and a young man is dead because she drove while drunk.
>>>>>
>>>>> Do we really know this to be true beyond any doubt?  Could it be that 
>>>>> it
>>>>> was the cyclist's fault, in part or entirely?
>>>>>
>>>>> One ought not drink and drive.  That's not the issue.  And by the
>>> available
>>>>> evidence, Bishop Cook ought not drink at all.  But that does not mean
>>> that
>>>>> she necessarily caused the accident.
>>>>>
>>>>> One reason not to drink and drive is that you will almost 
>>>>> automatically
>>> be
>>>>> presumed to be the cause of any accident in which you are involved.
>>>>>
>>>>> It may be that the evidence is clear but I haven't seen it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike M.
>>> 