[Magdalen] Anglicans Online Essays | Pierre Whalon | Marriage, The Episcopal Church, and the Anglican Communion

[James Oppenheimer-Crawford]

It seems the man is talking about what is already a done deal as if somehow
talking about it as if it were negotiable would somehow make that idea true.

I don't think the marrying of same sex couples is analogous with a priest
or even one diocese deciding to do something others might not care for.
The point is now that same sex marriage is a reality.  Nothing anyone says
will have any impact on that, because most of us know it is an idea whose
time has come and then some.

I am not sure what I would suggest Mr. Whalon or any other bishop ought to
do or say.  At this point, perhaps the best thing is not to say anything,
since the matter is in fact decided.  If some bishop actually thinks it is
not decided, I'm afraid that just shows why nobody really cares what these
putative authorities say anymore.

It is unfortunate that the authorities of the church did not take the high
road a long time ago, but they did not.  I don't judge them for that, but
it is not anyone else's fault that the world has long since passed them by
as utterly irrelevant.  Some will say we ought not to say that, but we had
no say in the matter; it was the deliberate silence of the Church that did
it to the Church.

It's not as if it were difficult.  We saw marriage as between one man and
one woman, and our view was flawed for not being sufficiently inclusive.
It doesn't take years to say that. It takes a sentence. But the Church did
not do it, and now they whine about being viewed as irrelevant, which is
sad, but they did it to themselves.

James W. Oppenheimer-Crawford
*“A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved,
except in memory. LLAP**”  -- *Leonard Nimoy

On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 6:16 PM, Ann Markle <ann.markle at aya.yale.edu> wrote:

> Jim, I think there is also a difference between discernment and the
> development of a cohesive theology.  I always heard that priesst do what
> they want (mostly liturgically), and think up the rationale later.  This is
> true with TEC, too, I think.  Discernment moves much more quickly than
> theological rationale.  I am happy for the theology, don't get me wrong.
> It is important.  But it doesn't necessarily come first.
>
> Ann
>
> The Rev. Ann Markle
> Buffalo, NY
> ann.markle at aya.yale.edu
> blog:  www.onewildandpreciouslife.typepad.com
>
> On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 5:37 PM, James Oppenheimer-Crawford <
> oppenheimerjw at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > It reminds me, for some reason, of the concerns raised about when to use
> > the word "whom" and when to use the word "who."
> >
> > Seems to me the discernment is a done deal. The hierarchy of TEC et al
> can
> > do what they do, but the discernment is a done deal.
> >
> > Am I saying I believe the opinion of the Church about theology is not
> very
> > important? I guess, in this case, I am.  It did not have to be this way,
> > but it is this way.
> >
> > James W. Oppenheimer-Crawford
> > *“A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved,
> > except in memory. LLAP**”  -- *Leonard Nimoy
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 13, 2015 at 11:15 AM, Lynn Ronkainen <houstonklr at gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Great article today from +Pierre W
> > >
> > > http://anglicansonline.org/resources/essays/whalon/marriage2015.html
> > >
> > >
> > > Sent from my iPhone
> > >
> >
>