[Magdalen] EC v. ED of Ft. Worth

[Grace Cangialosi]

Jay,
I've been saying for years that I don't think churches should own buildings and that the "tent making" model of ministry is better than that of full-time professional clergy serving a single congregation.

I guess that's where my real tendency toward heresy plays out.

> On Nov 3, 2014, at 2:22 PM, Jay Weigel <jay.weigel at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Lynn, when this comes up, I think about Nashuva, a Jewish congregation in
> the L.A. area http://nashuva.com which I would almost certainly be a part
> of if I were Jewish and lived there. They have purposely chosen not to have
> a permanent building location but to rent facilities from other communities
> (and not always the same ones!). They have a Shabbat service on the first
> Friday of each month and a social action project the third week of the
> month. I have started a tradition with myself of "attending" their Kol
> Nidre service on Yom Kippur via live streaming on my computer. I really
> like their rabbi, Naomi Levy, who always seems to have something pertinent
> to say to me, no matter where I am in my life. The way Nashuva (which, by
> the way, means " we return') is doing shul may be something like how God
> wants us to do Church. Just a thought.
> 
> On Mon, Nov 3, 2014 at 1:38 PM, Lynn Ronkainen <ichthys89 at comcast.net>
> wrote:
> 
>> sad all around... I do think that in the long run, the return of the
>> diocesan offices/camps etc are more important than the return of everything
>> if a space is provided for some kind of compromise between the parties
>> themselves or between judge and judgment.
>> 
>> In many ways, these kind of legal struggles heighten, for me, the vast
>> social changes afoot during the lifetime of the 'boomer' generation since
>> the mid 40s or a little bit before that. They also make me think more and
>> more about 'what doing church' really is... and if God is gently and not so
>> much, nudging us waaaay out of our comfort zone and more into the world, to
>> do God's work.
>> 
>> Still mourning for the history and spirituality of what is bound up so
>> much in all of these proceedings
>> 
>> Lynn
>> 
>> website: www.ichthysdesigns.com
>> 
>> When I stand before God at the end of my life I would hope that I have not
>> a single bit of talent left and could say, "I used everything You gave me."
>> attributed to Erma Bombeck
>> 
>> Thomas Merton writes, “People may spend their whole lives climbing the
>> ladder of success only to find, once they reach the top, that the ladder is
>> leaning against the wrong wall.”
>> 
>> "What you seek is seeking you." - Rumi
>> 
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Ginga Wilder" <gingawilder at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Monday, November 03, 2014 12:16 PM
>> To: "Magdalen" <magdalen at herberthouse.org>
>> 
>> Subject: Re: [Magdalen] EC v. ED of Ft. Worth
>> 
>> This USSC decision to reject the case will mark the path forward for
>>> TECSC.  And, we in new missions and worshipping communities now know that
>>> we won’t have our buildings back anytime soon, if at all.  That fact will
>>> be hard for some to grasp, but I do believe it is the truth.   As I have
>>> thought all along, these cases will not be settled in my lifetime.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Very sad, and all Episcopalians must grieve our loss, and then create a
>>> new
>>> faith community, looking forward, rather than hold to the stuff of the
>>> past.  That is my opinion.  History will happen, and at some point in the
>>> more distant future, the Lawrence church may fail and their buildings,
>>> etc.
>>> may have to be sold.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> In these days of a dwindling TEC, not having the burden of upkeep of old
>>> buildings may be a gift to fledgling congregation.  I do still want the
>>> intellectual and real diocesan (not parish) property returned sooner
>>> rather
>>> than later.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Ginga
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Nov 3, 2014 at 10:43 AM, Charles Wohlers <
>>> charles.wohlers at verizon.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I believe it means they refused to hear the case, meaning the lower court
>>>> ruling stands.
>>>> 
>>>> Chad Wohlers
>>>> about to head back North from sunny Florida,
>>>> Woodbury, VT USA
>>>> chadwohl at satucket.com
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Grace Cangialosi
>>>> Sent: Monday, November 03, 2014 10:18 AM
>>>> To: magdalen at herberthouse.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [Magdalen] EC v. ED of Ft. Worth
>>>> 
>>>> I'm sorry, but I don't know what this means.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Nov 3, 2014, at 9:51 AM, Roy Murphy <roy.murphy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cert denied. :(
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Mon, Nov 3, 2014 at 9:41 AM, Ginga Wilder <gingawilder at gmail.com>
>>>>> 
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> OK.  It's 9:30 am.  What's the story....yes, that is a ridiculous
>>>>>> inquiry.
>>>>>> But, members of TECSC are among those waiting on this decision. If USSC
>>>>>> takes the case and iff USSC decides on behalf of TEC, this will have
>>>>>> enormous impact on the South Carolina case.  I don't much care about
>>>>>> parish
>>>>>> real property issues, but I do indeed want our name, our symbols, our
>>>>>> trust
>>>>>> fund, our camp and conference center, our diocesan property ETC
>>>>>> returned
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> Episcpalians.  Others in TECSC sincerely are invested in having the
>>>>>> parish
>>>>>> properties.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> SC awaits the decision of Circuit Court Judge Diane Goodstein in the
>>>>>> lawsuit where Bp Lawrence and his breakaway church is suing TEC and
>>>>>> TECSC.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Ginga
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Sun, Nov 2, 2014 at 10:35 PM, Roy Murphy <roy.murphy at gmail.com>
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Did I say 11/1? Tomorrow at 9:30. My guess is that it gets relisted
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> another conference. That has been their recent practice.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Mon, Oct 20, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Roy Murphy <roy.murphy at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The Supreme Court docket says the case was distributed for the 10/31
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> conference. We could hear further news on 11/1. Either grant, deny or
>>>>>>>> relist.
>>>>